Talk:Fontaine's Department Store
Floatyness is not necessarily 'goodness' : The Game Theory reviews mentioned that not the hairbrained quantum pseudo-physics or the breathlessly high altitude would make Columbia impossible, but the floaty bit causing chronic sea/airsickness amongst the population. SO now we have floating building in Rapture to somehow be like Columbia (float would work as the open air spaces displace the heavy structure required to keep the ocean from crushing it ) but swaying with changing ocean currents and shifts in buoyancy shaking things from the shelves. Now its sunk? How much can be left unflooded - all having to be airtight sections or be a fatal crushing 20 atmospheres of air pressure. Somehow still hooked up to the city utilities (and vents?), not rolled over or tilting, etc... Simpler for Ryan to just turn off the air and power and eliminate the Splicers inside without property damage or having to waste/risk his personnel. Testxyz (talk) 07:05, November 14, 2013 (UTC) Ryan 'sinks' Fontaines Department Store to contain a whole lot of murderous Splicers ( a prison supposedly ?) and then doesnt lock the doors (the Bathysphere dock...) Shouldnt The THINKER be routing anyone unauthorized punching in that address straight to police headquarters for questioning ??? Nah those "No Tresspassing Signs" should be good enuf... Testxyz (talk) 09:50, November 14, 2013 (UTC) Shape Did anyone notice before that the shape of the houseware building is that of a seahorse? ZanyDragon (talk) 03:11, November 24, 2013 (UTC) Yes, and also that its tall and extremely thin, when the inside is a horizontal sprawl. (same for the main building) Im sure there will be some 'Tesla Coil' theory used to explain this and all the other weird stuff theyve added to Rapture I think the head over the main building is supposed to be Poseidon/Neptune who is classically shown being on a chariot drawn by 'seahorses' (the mythylogical horsey ones, not the 4 inch long fish). Testxyz (talk) 08:22, November 24, 2013 (UTC) The thing you mentioned about how the building is tall and thin but the level spread horizontally happens a lot in other bioshock games too. In Bioshock one for example, Point Prometheus is supposed to be the tallest skyscraper in Rapture, but the entire level (including the proving grounds which is at the top of Point Prometheus) is spread out horizontally and the entrance hall has a skylight even though the memorial museum should be directly on top of it. ( 00:39, January 17, 2014 (UTC)) The really tall building (Fontaines Lair/last boss fight level) is adjacent to the Museum which is adjacent to Point Prometheus (the LS/BD factory) . So they can be spread out and in 'Fontaine' level we are only in the top level of the tall(est) building (with that long elevator ride). Most of the outside views show rediculous (though impressive) vertical aspects (including 50 story buildings) and your being located way above some seabed far below (yet weirdly have rocks right next to many windows). Views of the exteriors of building we are inside of show windows not evident inside or completely differently arranged - so I would discount most of those details as filler/window dressing. So the Department Store where we see its outside (which is even more narrow / tall than previous games ) AND then we go inside to see how spread out/sprawling it is -- those are in direct conflict. But I dont think they much care at this point and they are trying to make Rapture more like Columbia (cavernous interiors, huge windows, the weird skyline things, etc). Of course with 'multiverse' now, Rapture could have been land of the Giant Mushrooms for all it matters Testxyz (talk) 05:06, January 17, 2014 (UTC) pix of the floorplan doesnt quite match that external, does it? : Looking at Art Deco (one characteristic is decorative 'towers') if they had thought a little they COULD have followed actual Art Deco better, making the Poseidon and his Seahorse Chariot Steeds a large decoration sitting above the actual squat blocky department store, it would have been more correct. : Instead of bizarrely wrong outside views not matching the inside floorplan at all (Rapture isnt supposed to have the 'fantasy amusement' perceptual distortion technology from the 39th century the way Columbia did.) "Who cares, it Just looked neat" seems to be the major influence on the scenery designers. Too much thin air ... Naming the Stores We call this whole level 'Fontaine's Department Store,' but perhaps that's incorrect. The Department Store seems to be the center building while the one on the left (right if you are inside) is the Housewares Building. Maybe we should be calling this business simply "Fontaine's" (like Macy's or Kohl's) while Fontiane's Department Store should discuss events in the central building. Thoughts? Also, what does the third store sell? Unownshipper (talk) 04:55, December 8, 2013 (UTC) Guns for the Splicers ?? Why would 'Prisoners' be allowed guns ??? The Audio Diaries talk of the 'prisoners' being delivered to the place. If there is some excuse like Fontaine had an arsenal stashed in the building, it would have been halfway imaginitive to mention that, if not actually have that as a place where Booker and Elizabeth see it. I doubt very much that ordinary department store workers would have tommyguns in their desks and lockers. The turrets even stranger - hacked ... fine, but they should be OUTSIDE the prison ready to slaughter prisoners trying to escape and be manned by the guards (who are missing). Likewise where is the EVE coming from to power up all the splicers?? Kinda stupid not removing every ounce of the stuff from this 'prison' to nullify any plasmids the inmates would have. (Ditto any ADAM products at all/gear whatever). But then - No shoot-em-up if things were that logical. Testxyz (talk) 11:50, December 12, 2013 (UTC) :I feel an important part of the department store's story that has been eclipsed in BaS. First according to most informations found in the DLC, the store must have been converted into a prison by the end of November/early December 1958, and truly sunk away near the end of December. Somehow, it remained in activity (possibly administrated by the Council or Ryan himself) after Fontaine's death and Fontaine Futuristics' seizure. Then, you can see in back rooms propaganda posters of Atlas, so there were probably a good amount of Atlas' followers among the store's workers who could have used the place to stash weapons for the upcoming New Year's Eve riots (the store is large enough for hidden places among the maintenance rooms). :I suppose that when the Council finally voted for throwing in the remaining followers of Fontaine, the rebels among the workers must have retaliated violently against Ryan's security forces, hence all those corpses of customers around. After that, the store was quickly converted into a prison in only ten days (i.e. locking down the bathysphere station, setting some makeshift turrets to calm down agitated prisoners). The city kept bringing them food to keep a good image to the public, then the store was sunk down to permanently prevent anyone from escaping it. It may be also possible the sinking was publicly declared as an accident, trapping a Big Daddy and his Little Sister in the process, though those may just have been on some training field and have a way to go back up once gathering enough ADAM. :Pauolo (talk) 19:22, December 12, 2013 (UTC) :It is becoming one of those cases (like Booker/Comstock's rediculously short 3 year rise to Columbia) of too many things being shoehorned into too little time. :If the building was seized some short time after Fontaines death, it was likely to be searched like Neptunes Bounty was, evidence impounded, criminal minions apprehended, closed up while the Council decided what to do -- locked up tight if it was actually 'shutdown' - (so in all cases no customers there - maybe the customers were from a immediate gunfight with Fontaines minions still resisting, but this isnt Civil War Rapture yet, so bodies would not remain- customers particularly). :Using it as a prison - not the best structure for that purpose (and prisons are usually manned) . Again probably would get a thorough searching if it was going to become a prison. All the stuff in plain sight (particularly ADAM related) - no sense whatsoever. :Additional prisoner brought in - all searched/restrained - letting them have free run of the place is pretty weak. Whenever food stopped being brought in mustve been very recent - doesnt take too long to starve (if it was still in progress then why no guards?)... :Sunk to 'dispose' of Fontaines thugs ?? Real sinking ... the Utilities get severed - it becomes a cold dark tomb - no power/light, no air, no heat, no transport (so the whole sinking thing really makes no sense with whats shown - just 'sounded good' I guess) Why not just flood the place and be done with it? Sink it into the Abyss 'never to be seen again' ... :- :Hints that the 'Atlas' stuff was happening before Fontaines 'death' ?? (makes sense though McDonagh comments nobody heard of Atlas before Kashmir, but thats non-conclusive (as just about ALL the Audio Diaries are). :The Little Sister and Big Daddy dont fit overly well since this (sinking) happened (however long) before Kashmir - though I dont recall Eleanor/Delta factually being being declared 'first'. :Cohen knowing where Sally is is a whole 'nuther set of weirdness being involved (why should he know the details of an operational Little Sister (and which one is which???). :Ive said it seems to have been thrown together on the back of a Denny's Napkin, seems more and more like that . :Testxyz (talk) 04:32, December 13, 2013 (UTC) : While I originally believed Booker/Comstock's rise to Columbia to be somewhat quick as well, looking into it, though it can still definitely come off as condensed, it appears to take inspiration from or at least reference real-life religious figures, such as Joesph Smith (the founder of Mormonism). Similarly, he had been young, only 24, when he became a prominent religious figure and attracted ten of thousands of followers at the time. Now Comstock's sect combined what was seen as American values at the time and Christianity, which obviously resonated with the rise of American exceptionalism in that later portion of the century. Also seems a bit like it was supposed to be symbolically divine. H. Roosevelt (talk) 03:22, September 25th, 2019 ::Comstock appeared much older than her actually was. Even with just the beard he looks a lot older than Booker and then add in the premature ageing from tear exposure. Also Booker had been playing older for some time before Wounded Knee. He was only 16 at Wounded Knee so he was at best only 16 and probably only 15 when he joined up. The legal age at the time was 18 (with a few exceptions and none of them apply) and they had made Booker a Corporal before Wounded Knee happened. So the US Army didn't know how old he really was. As for part of how Booker got away with it, the average male height in 1912 at age 21 was only 5 foot 8 1/4 inches. Booker was 6 foot 1 (About 5 inches taller than average). Back in 1890 people were even shorter. So even at 15 or 16 he would still have been taller than most people. sm --Solarmech (talk) 11:51, September 25, 2019 (UTC) Smell of Death : The smell of corpses. Not year old ones (or somehow 8 year old ones in BS2) -- Nice recent ones in 'Fontaines Department Store' Booker should have made a comment on arriving . Its only been a few months at most the Splicers have been killing each other. The huge rediculous interior volumes of the place cant absorb the smell of all those corpses we see everywhere. Elizabeth going off into a corner to vomit might have been an interesting scene and then not looking so chippy from then on. Testxyz (talk) 11:34, December 12, 2013 (UTC) :I recall this one area near the end where you go down some stairs (I believe that there's a turret with some corpses and debris) and Elizabeth makes a comment on how much it smells. She holds her nose the whole while you're down there UpgradeTech (talk) 05:36, December 13, 2013 (UTC) ::And thinking back to canon (the book), there were still fighting and deaths happening BEFORE the New Years Riots and Rapture's fall from grace either between Fontaine's and Ryan's forces or between civil disputes especially in the poorer regions, so people were faced with death and dead bodies and most likely tried their best to ignore it. I've noticed you seem to have a personal vendetta against Bioshock Infinite and it's affiliate DLCs Testxyz :::He has one though he's not the only one, and that's annoying to always hear one complains on how a video game is unrealistic. Pauolo (talk) 08:54, March 20, 2014 (UTC) :The DLC does seem to be just thrown together. The part at the end of Infinite does seem tacked on to have the DLC in Rapture. Is the book actually considered canon? Ive heard it both ways. :- : ::So you think all DLCs are being made during the development of the main game? IG started working on both of them at the same time once Infinite was released and when 2K Games gave its approval for the Season Pass plan. The proof is, there are lines of texts in the files of the first episode which should belong to the second. Even the crossbow model can already be found in those files. Still if you think of it, IG had a whole year to work on those additional stories, and even though the first one seemed to lack a bit I'm pretty sure they put everything they worked on on the second. Pauolo (talk) 15:47, March 20, 2014 (UTC) ::- ::'Started working' is defined as what? Planning is supposed to be part of 'working' and is it so impossible they did none of that whatsoever while the primary game was still to be finished ? ::Especially with the Season Pass thing they already were getting ready to sell they HAD BETTER be working on what they were going to deliver within some reasonable amount of time. ::"Thrown together" actually refers to it being a 'hack' job when their primary concern is to milk it for as much money as possible and screw any cohesion with the previous products and not caring about details adding up (come to think of it reuse of 'Bioshock' for Infinite is pretty much that as well.) ::Rafts of Absurdity ..... starting with 'Ken' declaring this is Rapture "Prime" (whatever that means) when the whole Infinite Plotline is built on infinite parallel different worlds and crossing over between them along with all the other 'quantum' gobbledeegook they just made up... now tainting Bioshock Rapture. ::There often is a time when the original authors no longer can decide what is "canon" ::- ::I think you should read this article on Polygon, might be more helpful to explain what I meant. You might want to jump to "The quiet period" which relates to what happened after Infinite went gold in February of last year, but feel free to read the whole story which is quite enlightening. Still I do agree with you, Levine is an ass and just sounds phony when he publicly expresses himself. Also I don't approve of all the expensive stuff they sell at their shop when NECA's products were enough for BioShock 2. ::I don't like too the "Rapture Prime" quote which is surprisingly often used by idiotic posters to show they know a bit more than half of Infinite (or whatever game in the series for what matters...). However I believe Levine meant that the world of Rapture in BaS was basically the same as in the first games with an exception that may change the whole story ::You're right of talking about Infinite (or more Columbia) tainting Rapture, because I'm sure that's exactly what happens in the story of BaS, though the first episode remains elusive on the subject, possibly on purpose. To develop a bit more, with the story as it is in BaS it is possible the bombing on New Year's Eve might not even happen since "Fontaine's followers" (in reality Atlas') are trapped at the department store. Even Atlas getting caught is rather odd in itself, unless Ryan had a way to see his plan coming like Comstock did with Booker (though yes that didn't help him much in the end :D ). Anyway, even if they are freed by Elizabeth, they would not have the time to plan the attack in the few hours left before the end of the day. And if that event were to never happen, there would be none of the events of BioShock or BioShock 2, because Atlas would have lost too early for him to get Jack into Rapture, have him kill Ryan, etc... ::So yes, "Rapture Prime" was a stupid thing to say because Prime means nothing at all here, or maybe Levine just ankwardly tried to remained elusive on the subject (like he does for everything else). ::But following my reasoning, I don't believe the authors are trying to change the canon. On the contrary, they're telling a story which no one really thought about, though it is logical to expect Tears opening on Rapture could also impact it. It is even possible the end of BaS episode 2 will end this tainting of Rapture, probably the whole purpose of the story. However I'm not fond of the fact that this all happens because whichever Columbia linked to this particular Rapture was not erased, and that because its concerned Comstock met a much different fate than all the others. Honestly, that's just a detail and I saw worse than that to explain an additional story. ::Pauolo (talk) 16:07, March 21, 2014 (UTC) ::Interesting article, though I wonder how typical in the game industry their path was (particularly with their 'Fearless Leader' often spending alot of time on other projects). I have seen other games mess up in major ways because they kept changing directions /didnt settle down soon enuf. Levine's mentioned obcession with 'historical accuracy' either fell to the wayside, or didnt extend to how people really thought in those times. ::For the BaS DLC they simply had to say "Heres Rapture minding its own business and in pops the Meddlers from Columbia Universe -- lets watch as things flow down a very different path ". Resulting in not a "Butterfly Effect" on steroids, but grossly wrenching (heh) Rapture off on a different path (not your 'fathers Variables and Constants', which that actually could have been shown itself to be a delusion of the Luteces .. thereby re-warping players understanding of THAT story - they aint the godlike beings they are presented as). ::Having the entire 'alternate' history of Rapture changed (honestly) instead of trying to pretend its somehow the same (if it doesnt result in the same detailed sequence BS1/BS2, then it aint 'Prime' any more). It would also prevent having to do alot of "16 lefts thru the cloverleaf intersection to do a right" to somehow show how it all aligns back up again (if they mean to do that) instead of a cleaner new 'what-if' story. ::I dont even care about trying to resolve what has been shown in the games because it already is inconsistant with itself and assumes things that have nothing to do with the overlying system of the universe (quantum multiverse has nothing to do with real time travels or going back to undo things). ::Maybe they will pull a rabbit out of the hat and have Elizabeth finally 'figure it out' and go destroy the Luteces (before they started, being the real root cause) in the BaS2 final ending with some philisophical BS (heh) about the universe seeking/returning to equilibrium or somesuch (annd Elizabeth only being a manifestation of that force, etc.. etc... (Otherwise might as well have the BennyHill ending with all the characters chasing each other between infinite LightHouse doors in fast motion) ::Testxyz (talk) 22:48, March 22, 2014 (UTC) Fontaine's TRAM developers art : www.laurazimmermann.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/02/SeahorseTram.jpg Shows mechanism was expected (by artist at least) to operate on a cable, as all the Bathyspheres in Rapture actually should. The 'F' on the Fontaine label on the model is very odd The Buildings' name Checking the names of the different playable zones in both episodes of Burial at Sea, I believe the main building is in fact called "the Pavilion" since that's also the name for the central hub where all departments inside can be accessed. For the so-called Housewares building, I frankly don't know. Housewares seem to only describes its main departments (Electronics and Appliances) on the floor where the tram station is located, but as seen in the second episode it is quite vast, with (Bathyspheres DeLuxe) acting as a hub on an upper floor. The blueprints to the building only name it as Fontaine's Department Store No1 with a technical name for the structure (Vertical Panel something, gotta recheck the exact name), but no mention of a specific one. Honestly I would suggest calling Housewares only the floor we explore in the first episode, while the second is the bathysphere showroom, the academy and the sex shop. Pauolo (talk) 07:21, April 7, 2014 (UTC) :I respectfully disagree. The Pavilion is just the main, multi-story hub within the central building. We know the names of each structure because from outside, each building is labeled with a giant sign. One says Housewares, one is labeled Fontaine's Department Store, and the other one is unknown. Why would they put a gigantic sign on the outside of the building unless that was its name? That would be like calling the entire building "Bridal." :Unownshipper (talk) 20:03, April 7, 2014 (UTC) ::Not that much unknown, more like hard to read since they're not lit. It is simply written Ladieswear and Menswear, or some other departments which are featured in the main building. They just reused the signs at the entrance of those departments. However, naming it Housewares is a bit minimalist, but maybe that's just to discern the main departments at Fontaine's. ::For the Pavilion, well I believe you're right. I checked again and it seems to just name buildings with a large open space inside. ::Btw just to mention, the complete name for the whole complex is Fontaine's Department Store (as seen on the blueprints for the Housewares tower in BaS 2), often shortened as Fontaine's (which sounds nicer imho :D). We should probably delete the Fontaine's page then. ::Pauolo (talk) 20:28, April 7, 2014 (UTC) :::Well I just checked, and you are indeed correct about the blueprints listing the whole complex as Fontaine's Department Store (seems like a bad idea, but I guess the designers know best). :::I'm not against deleting the page, however (in my experience) it usually takes forever before any articles marked for deletion actually are deleted. For MONTHS the Fontaine's page was the incorrectly spelled article "Fontaine Department Store" before I just went ahead and repurposed it to something more useful. :::Proposition: :::What if we were to rename the Fontaine's page to "Fontaine's Department Store (Business)" similar to the way we have Fontaine Futuristics (Level) and Fontaine Futuristics (Business)? That way we can distinguish between the location and the operation so that we don't have one unnecessarily long page. Thoughts? :::Unownshipper (talk) 22:41, April 10, 2014 (UTC) :::Sounds like a great idea, that way we can have the facets of the location organized and compartmentalized. :::AndyRyan (talk) 22:45, April 10, 2014 (UTC) Burial at Sea episode two departments Since we list all of the departments we travel to in Episode one (Electronics, Toys, etc.), why not the ones we visit in episode two (The Silver Fin, Bathyspheres DeLuxe, Ryan the Lion Prep Academy), after all, they are part of the department store. Since I don't want to start an editing war, I thought it would be wise to bring my proposal here. AndyRyan (talk) 12:25, April 8, 2014 (UTC) :We listed Electronics, Toys, and all of the departments we travel to in the second part of Episode One on the Housewares page. Why would we list the departments in Episode Two here when they are located in the Housewares building and not the Department Store building? Shouldn't we divide the shops between the buildings they are located in? :Unownshipper (talk) 22:30, April 9, 2014 (UTC) ::I see your point, but all three of the buildings make up Fontaine's, so Fontaine's Department Store refers to the Pavillion, Housewares, and the third building. The would be like considering Sears Retail and Sears Car Service as seperate entities. Since Fontaine's is a cumulative term, the Fontaine's Department Store page should encompass all departments, services, and outlets offered by the store. ::AndyRyan (talk) 01:46, April 10, 2014 (UTC) :::I can't speak to the layout of a Sears department store. However, has it been stated that Fontaine's was directly modeled after Sears, Macy's, Harrods, or any specific modern-day department store? I'm sure they're all different in their own way and just because the stores in Fontaine's are laid out among different a trio of buildings doesn't mean they're seperate entities, just VERY large departments. :::If you will check the Fontaine's Department Store editing history and go back far enough, all of the stores you could visit in Burial at Sea - Episode 1 used to be listed on that one page. It was rediculously long and disorganized because it listed the business' history, all the stores, and the walkthrough for Episode One all on one page. Later, the Housewares page was made and by dividing the info across the two pages it helped to make the article less cluttered. :::I think this is exactly why the Fontaine's page is necessary. Not only can you use the page to talk specifically about the business itself, you can add a succint directory with the names of the businesses in the two buildings if you want while greater detail is put on the articless for the two individual buildings. :::Unownshipper (talk) 07:34, April 10, 2014 (UTC) ::::The only point I disagree on having a Fontaine's page is because the name is simply shortened from Fontaine's Department Store. It would be like having a Persephone Correctional Facility page and another one named simply Persephone, or as it was made some months ago an Hephaestus page and another one named Hephaestus Power Facility. Also if we're gonna make a directory, we need to separate what are really the departments from the other stores and recreational areas, like Cupid's Arrow or Ryan the Lion Preparatory Academy. I'll think of a way to display it on both the main page for Fontaine's Department Store and the Housewares building. ::::Also just a quick question: is Bathyspheres DeLuxe considered as a department or simply the store for a branch of Fontaine Futuristics? It is not really displayed like any of the other departments (Housewares Appliances, Electronics, Menswear, Plasmids, et cetera...). Pauolo (talk) 07:58, April 10, 2014 (UTC) ::::I do think that Bathyspheres DeLuxe counts as a department, and as all of Fontaine's (besides private businesses, like Cupid's Arrow and Ryan the Lion) provide Fontaine Futuristics manufactured products, they could all be condiered departments. ::::AndyRyan (talk) 13:39, April 10, 2014 (UTC) Main page removed *Some of the ads around the store are based off vintage ads for Modiano cigarettes. Factoids still worthy to preserve.... Trapped in Department Store Some of the other pages say that is was just Fontaine's Splicers who were imprisoned in the department store, this page claims it was Fontaine's followers but I feel there were a little more than that given that there were also employees, such as Samantha Kemp, trapped in there (of whom their only affiliation with Fontaine is working in the department store) or even Ryan's security men, like Emmett Wyman and Moses Lydecker. Then of course, there's Atlas and his band of followers, though it seems like Atlas' followers back up in Rapture weren't imprisoned and it was just Atlas and his (Fontaines) closest circle of henchmen Tricksteroffools (talk) 17:52, July 5, 2014 (UTC) :Yeah…all in all, the department store conversion seems like a rushed job. Lydecker was stuck in there while Wyman seems to have had no real back up or support. Really a poorly conceived idea. :Samantha Kemp's inclusion seems tenuous at best, but unfortunately we don't have more details. Maybe they really did just round up everyone with a Fontaine connection and throw them in there without due process. Maybe that would explain all the well-dressed corpses of normal-looking people scattered about. The outrage over such an action would also explain why so many in Rapture turned on Ryan. :Unownshipper (talk) 21:30, July 5, 2014 (UTC) :Yeah its a little sloppy, some corpses looks like they where just shopping and where gunned down, which doesn't make seance at all?!?! where there some kind of riot in the department store before closing and then they converted it??? The Department store doesn't look to be converted at all btw; people lived there for about a month I believe, and there's not many signs of people settling down, Sure there where splicing and battles but still; no mattresses? In BioShock and 2 you could see that people tried to make some kind of home/shelter where ever they where trapped. And whats up with Ryan's forces busting in and killing everyone? it was a prison! far away from the city with mines everywhere around it, how would they get out??? with out Elizabeth, they would have no chance. --Shacob (talk) 22:40, July 5, 2014 (UTC) The riot thing might make some sense (but why should Fontaine waste resources he could use later as Atlas?) How about a Riot by ordinary Rapture folk in outrage against Fontaines criminality or at least looting by those he had betrayed (joined by employees expecting to be out of a job or some 'Jubilee' for all the people that Fontaine had harmed, while Ryan and City Authorities looked the other way). It doesn't make sense for Ryan to just leave/lock in ordinary "Fontaine's" employees in the mall (most were likely just businesses Fontaine had purchased, and many people in other stores/facilities there were not even Fontaine's employees. Couple a hundred people, including customers? Why would Ryan do that knowing it would be treated as an outrage and be largely ineffective anyway. This was long before the Civil War started when required measures against Atlas supporters escalated. If people were initially rounded up immediately after the Neptunes Bounty Shootout to grab Fontaine's known co-conspitators (remember Sullivan had been watching them for months/years), then months have gone by and all those uninvolved would have been long previously released (and the detention place would have been crawling with Rapture Security, and not the idiotic situation where the thugs are allowed to run free). There already was a very fine jail complex at Persephone to house the perps in with nice proper security measures and facilities. Why waste a perfectly good building which would otherwise make a very poor insecure prison ? The real reason was that they needed an abnormal situation in which the players gunplay and slaughter could be done. Imagine if Booker had been allowed to shoot up Market and High Street. But why would THAT normal scene be awash with guns and ammo and buffs and crazy Splicers and preexisting wreckage? So they had to contrive such a scene when that kind of thing really didnt exist yet in Rapture (even Neptunes Bounty would have been cleaned up and put back in business to feed the city) Supposedly 'Neat' scenes and plot gimmics forced into the old Rapture Failtopia theme sunk the whole story into the Abyss. 10:05, July 6, 2014 (UTC) Evil Ryan's goons coming to kill them all? Why not have made it a rival faction in the prisoners who wanted to put an end to 'Atlas' trying to lord it over them ?? City closed area fighting is nasty - usually 50-50 odds for everyone involved). 10:05, July 6, 2014 (UTC) And the Quantum Floaty stuff. So it floated up (somehow Elizabeth had become a quantum engineer) -- to where? To 'dock' with the place it used to be connected to? Filling a balloon with gas to make it rise doesnt mean you can fly the balloon like an airplane. ( disconnected from the City's Utilities for months is a seperate issue) . Ocean currents make it drift away and it sometime later is found wrecked on the coast of Greenland filled with drowned frozen corpses (but have Atlas sneak away in a smuggling sub he had arranged for, to have continuity with BS1) 10:05, July 6, 2014 (UTC) We know the store did not float away as we can see the Lutece Device in Suchong's lab at the end of the game on a monitor. To keep the building from going anywhere all you would need to do would be anchor it with some good strong cables. --Solarmech (talk) 12:33, July 6, 2014 (UTC) Good strong rather large cables, by who and where and how ?? And who was to do that, immediately while it was floating further and further away ?? If Atlas somehow had all the equipment handy (including subs) then why not simply escape that way? No, the quantum plot crutch strikes again. Somewhere else is an article talking about Columbia's 'floatyness' making the place unlivable by most people because of the motion and vibrartions making people continually nauseous (a similar problem for this 'flaoting' department store). Maybe Fink made his first fortune selling Dr Finks Nausea Relief Medicine to the occupants of Columbia (from the first day of its existence, as even the construction workers would be hurling from the alien sensations) :I think we're getting off subject. This has nothing to do with the discussion of the people in the Dept Store who don't seem to belong there. Please remember to sign your posts. :Unownshipper (talk) 01:30, July 7, 2014 (UTC)